Programming with .NET - General

Re: Re: Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

JohnDMathis — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 04:27:51 GMT

Just adding my 2 cents...there MUST be a middle ground solution that maintains security without sacrificing keyboard input in full screen mode. FIND IT.

John

Re: Re: Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

mepfuso — Wed, 14 Oct 2009 09:18:08 GMT

mikerussellnz:
At least allow the arrow keys to work for games. its not like people use those in their passwords!!!

lol, yes there might be some truth in that.

Re: Re: Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

mikerussellnz — Wed, 14 Oct 2009 04:12:41 GMT

At least allow the arrow keys to work for games. its not like people use those in their passwords!!!

Maybe also Page Up, Page Down, Home, End etc. CTRL, ALT etc.

Even without the A-Z 0-9 keys, that would be at least more useful.

Re: Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

SCarpenter — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 18:24:54 GMT

Thanks Herthoren!
As of Oct. 10, 2009 that keyboard request is #14 (out of 260+ fet. req.) and my suggestion ranks # 19. We're not alone!
http://silverlight.uservoice.com/pages/4325-feature-suggestions/suggestions/311279-maintain-full-screen-on-secondary-display-

Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

Herthoren — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 09:23:56 GMT

There is a new official-like SL4 request tracker, you can vote for this feature there.

http://silverlight.uservoice.com/pages/4325-feature-suggestions/suggestions/311096-full-screen-with-full-keyboard-support?ref=title

Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

mepfuso — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 10:08:23 GMT

From a usability point of view, ignoring key strokes in full screen mode is horrible. Most normal users out there don't know about this fact and wonder what's wrong. At least, Microsoft should fade in some message, unobtrusively, say, at the bottom right as some transparent layer, informing the user that due to security reasons key input is disabled. Sure, I could handle that myself, but attaching event handlers to each and every input control is tedious. Best solution would of course be to enable keyboard input in certain scenarios like trusted zones in the intranet, and/or use a dialog box in administrator mode to unlock this feature once for every application.

Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

SCarpenter — Sat, 29 Aug 2009 04:21:19 GMT

This whole page was enlightening and I'm not any kind of programmer, just one of millions of frustrated Netflix users dealing with the forced Silverlight update and it's resulting screw up of my dual display living room HTPC. We're having a fun debate on why SL loses full screen when it loses focus over at http://silverlight.net/forums/p/99756/278248.aspx.
Similar security concerns raised here were the explanation of "why" and some of us wondered "why not give me choice?". From what I read SL can't begin in full screen unless I click on something in the first place so can anyone explain why it can't stay that way?
It's a cross - I know - sorry. I just thought some of the folks on this post knew more about what could be done than over at the other post. And I am the nut who opens a new browser to do online banking, closes it, opens another to check mail, closes it... some people aren't as careful. Still, programmatic security measures can't protect everyone.

Re: Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

jackbond — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 01:07:10 GMT

ossc_webapp:
<p></p>

If your goal is to rack up a bunch of points quickly, I can pretty much guarantee you your account is going to be deleted by Monday. Get a life.

Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

Herthoren — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 10:34:43 GMT

Well, I really hope the charge thing not going to happen (it's impossible to test through every version of an application completely, also what could they base the pricing on? It obviously can be a lot cheaper to test through an application that has fewer user interaction features etc... very hard to measure by any exact property of a certain app), though it would still be better than no full-screen + full-keyboard support at all.

While I still don't see why a seperate allowance for every domain would be so insecure, there is one thing in the post above that I really think could help a lot in the way towards solving this problem.

iii) A minimal silverlight branded bar could replace the browser UI.

This way, although we couldn't actually use the whole screen for display, at least we could get the mouse position from even the very corners of the screen, which I think is an important thing we need full-screen full-keyboard support for.

One example:

Imagine any application, where the user can scroll through the user interface by moving the mouse to the edge of the screen. If we can't actually catch the mouse position at every side of the screen, this scrolling method will perform very poorly, the user will have to move her mouse back and find the "sensitive spot" of the UI. Even if we put a relatively thick scroll-sensitive area at the side, it's never guaranteed that the user won't move her mouse too fast so that the pointer flies over the area, not to mention, a thick area will make the UI scroll, even if wasn't the user's intention at all.

Moving the browsers full screen won't help this, because browser UIs still have frames at at least one side of the screen, from where we can't capture mouse position.

So please, even if it really is such a huge security concern to allow users specify certain domains that they trust and are willing to give full-screen full-keyboard support to, at least let us capture the whole screen for mouse coordinates (with full-keyboard support).

With a silverlight branded bar, or even frame, this could be possible.

Thank you

Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

rleclerc — Wed, 01 Jul 2009 23:14:13 GMT

I also don't see a good enough reason to justify no-full screen mode.

1) You already get a notification that you are in full screen mode so it should be obvious that you are in the browser still.

2) You can already full screen with F11.

3) You can expand the screen beyond the dimensions of the monitor and reposition it so you can see the borders.

Some possible solutions or compromises which the Silverlight team could implement are:

i) On loading of the application of first use, the user could be promted for access to Full-Screen keyboard support as a more privleged level of access to a trusted site.

ii) An ActiveX-style notification bar could be shown at the top allowing users to "close notification bar this one time", "always close notification bar for this site"

iii) A minimal silverlight branded bar could replace the browser UI.

iv) Microsoft could charge for a special application license that provides heightened access to the client. With an entrance fee of $1000-$5000 this would probably disuade most phishing sites from trying this.

Demand is there, and the "security" worries seem to be more paranoia than rational.

Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

Bill Reiss — Wed, 29 Apr 2009 22:57:44 GMT

The one problem with your argument is that they actually had to add code to make keyboard not work in full screen mode, It is a legitimate security concern. Flash doesn't allow you access to the keyboard in full screen either from what I understand for the same reasons.

Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

jackbond — Wed, 29 Apr 2009 22:47:37 GMT

If your app fills the browser window 100%, you can use the web browsers full screen toggle(F11 in IE I think) to go full screen and you will have keyboard support.

To put it bluntly, the "security concerns" are a load of crap. They also had "security concerns" about a FileSaveDialog, and yet they somehow magically disappeared, and now Silverlight 3 has a FileSaveDialog.

Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

bradburdge — Wed, 29 Apr 2009 18:33:24 GMT

Hi Me Again,

Now im really confused.. in the same MSDN docs it appears to be contradictary to the full-screen info that i just posted.

Link:

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc189015(VS.95).aspx

bread crumb:

MSDN > MSDN Library > Silverlight > Silverlight 2 > Visual Design > Input > Keyboard Support

quote:

"....

Keyboard Events and Full-Screen Mode

When a Silverlight plug-in is displayed in full-screen mode, keyboard events are prevented from being passed to keyboard event handlers in the application. The only keyboard input that is acted upon is the set of keystrokes that returns the Silverlight plug-in to embedded mode. This limitation of keyboard input during full-screen mode is a security feature. It is intended to minimize the possibility of unintended information being entered by a user into an application that is impersonating another application visually. See Full-Screen Support.

....".

UNFORTUNATELY, i have been making development and business decisions based upon the first post i made where limited keyboard support is advertised... I still cant get the keyboard events to fire... so either im not implementing correctly... or it is just not supported... Either way the docs on MSDN are inconsistent and misleading.

Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

bradburdge — Wed, 29 Apr 2009 18:01:08 GMT

Folks,

According to the Silverlight 2 docs there has been some limited support for keyboard interaction when in full-screen mode.

Here is the link:

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc189023(VS.95).aspx

bread crumb trail:

MSDN > MSDN Library > Silverlight > Silverlight 2 > Visual Design > Full-Screen Support

quote:

".......

When a Silverlight plug-in is in full-screen mode, it disables most keyboard events. This limitation of keyboard input during full-screen mode is a security feature, and is intended to minimize the possibility of unintended information being entered by a user. In full-screen mode, the only input allowed is through the following keys.

UP ARROW, DOWN ARROW, LEFT ARROW, RIGHT ARROW, SPACEBAR, TAB, PAGE UP, PAGE DOWN, HOME, END, ENTER

..."

That all said... I still can't get any keyboard event messages to fire in my Silverlight applications. Even after creating my own event delegates and so forth, i still cant get the keyboard events to fire in my application. Any suggestions!!!!

Re: keyboard is not working with full screen

mscrocdile — Sat, 31 Jan 2009 12:19:32 GMT

Exactly.

It is nice MS is trying to save the whole world but advantage of the full screen of the Silverlight application is lost. The long showing message is sufficient security step. Don't restrict silverlight possibilities because of several inattentive users. Silverlight would not save them.